Orcon ADSL issues today (Sunday 5 Dec)?

[Steven Ellis]

Got major problems browsing anywhere using Orcon today. Is it just them
or do other ISPs have issues.

Most sites, including Orcon's home page, won't even load. www.xtra.co.nz
works, as does www.paradise.co.nz, but www.google.co.nz often doesn't
even resolve DNS.

I've rebooted router and firewall with no change.

It was getting pretty bad on Saturday, but this morning it is unusable.

Steve

[John Morch]

I use both UBS and ADSL from Orcon (2 seperate Circuits)
and had no problems noticed with either today.

Subject: Orcon ADSL issues today (Sunday 5 Dec)?
Date: Sun, 05 Dec 2004 18:44:27 +1300
Got major problems browsing anywhere using Orcon today. Is it just them or
do other ISPs have issues.
Most sites, including Orcon's home page, won't even load. www.xtra.co.nz
works, as does www.paradise.co.nz, but www.google.co.nz often doesn't even
resolve DNS.
I've rebooted router and firewall with no change.
It was getting pretty bad on Saturday, but this morning it is unusable.
Steve
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adsl" in the body of the message

_________________________________________________________________
Check out news, entertainment and more @ http://xtra.co.nz/broadband

[Steven Ellis]

Post by John Morch
I use both UBS and ADSL from Orcon (2 seperate Circuits)
and had no problems noticed with either today.

Got through to Orcon just now. They have other customers with the same
issues which relate to Layer 3 UBS issues.

Steve

[Steve Phillips]

Got major problems browsing anywhere using Orcon today. Is it just them or do
other ISPs have issues.

[snip]

It was getting pretty bad on Saturday, but this morning it is unusable.

And of course you have tried ringing Orcon helpdesk and asking them ?

I fail to see why this requires a post to the ADSL technical mailing list.

please keep OT posts to -chat.

(I've even CC'd that so you can simply trim the address field.)

[Steven Ellis]

Yes i've spoken to Orcon. Yes there is a problem.

It is a technical issue with Layer 3 UBS. They can't say if it has
affected other ISPs

Hence isn't this the correct place to discuss it?

Steve

[Steven Ellis]

Hmm

There is a TECHNICAL issue.. Hence reference technical email list..

I don't subscribe to chat as i'm only interested in technical
problem/issues etc.

Steve

Post by Steven Ellis
Yes i've spoken to Orcon. Yes there is a problem.
It is a technical issue with Layer 3 UBS. They can't say if it has
affected other ISPs
Hence isn't this the correct place to discuss it?

No.
somehow tell me how this relates to the technical side of the DSL world ?
To me it seems markedly like an Orcon/Telecom/Service issue, why not
keep harassing them until such time as you get an answer or if you
really must ask other people then do it on the correct list.
As you seem completely incapable of choosing the right list I have
sent it to the right one.
kthnxby

[Mark Foster]

Its not about DSL at a technical level, as it appears to be Orcon specific
- and its certainly the kind of thing that should be addressed via their
tech support guys.

I can understand Steves frustration, as there seems to be a trend to post
on here about issues which really should go straight to helpdesks first.

I mean, I know that people with a slight technical bent dont tend to like
helpdesks - its that whole 'I know more than they do' mentality coupled
with the 'i dont want to sit on hold' mentality - however it does need to
be take into consideration that

1) they provide a service, this includes (or not) tech support.
2) This is a list for the discussion of ADSL Technical issues. This doesnt
extend to doing the ISP tech support role for them...

I personally think Steve is being slightly Nazi here, but untill such time
as this becomes a 'problem with UBS in general' it really is of limited
interest to a lot of the audience here, some of whom don't use UBS and
many of whom will not be Orcon customers.

IMHO.

Mark.

Post by Steven Ellis
Hmm
There is a TECHNICAL issue.. Hence reference technical email list..
I don't subscribe to chat as i'm only interested in technical
problem/issues etc.
Steve

[Steven Ellis]

Technical issue isn't UBS specific but Layer 3 specific.

Steve

[Tony Paterson]

For my money it's close enough.

I've been on this list a long time and its moved to more of a broadband focus, which I personally think is fine - after all people post about WiredCountry and Woosh.

Of course we have a moderator....

Just my two cents

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-***@unixathome.org on behalf of Mark Foster
Sent: Sun 5/12/2004 9:26 p.m.
To: Steven Ellis
Cc: Steve Phillips; ***@lists.unixathome.org
Subject: Re: Orcon ADSL issues today (Sunday 5 Dec)?



Its not about DSL at a technical level, as it appears to be Orcon specific
- and its certainly the kind of thing that should be addressed via their
tech support guys.

I can understand Steves frustration, as there seems to be a trend to post
on here about issues which really should go straight to helpdesks first.

I mean, I know that people with a slight technical bent dont tend to like
helpdesks - its that whole 'I know more than they do' mentality coupled
with the 'i dont want to sit on hold' mentality - however it does need to
be take into consideration that

1) they provide a service, this includes (or not) tech support.
2) This is a list for the discussion of ADSL Technical issues. This doesnt
extend to doing the ISP tech support role for them...

I personally think Steve is being slightly Nazi here, but untill such time
as this becomes a 'problem with UBS in general' it really is of limited
interest to a lot of the audience here, some of whom don't use UBS and
many of whom will not be Orcon customers.

IMHO.

Mark.

Post by Steven Ellis
Hmm
There is a TECHNICAL issue.. Hence reference technical email list..
I don't subscribe to chat as i'm only interested in technical
problem/issues etc.
Steve

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To unsubscribe: send mail to ***@lists.unixathome.org
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[Steve Phillips]

If I wanted to be subscribed to
orcon-adsl-helpdesk-***@lists.unixathome.org then I have little doubt
that I would subscribe.

I have however NOT subscribed to that list and do not really see why I am
getting a sudden influx of these messages.

If I wanted to do helpdesk work then no doubt I would go and find myself
a job in that area.

Please have the common decency to keet this list on topic. We have already
lost a fair few notable names in the industry from this list due to the
lack of thought of the posters (not to mention the fact that some people
posting here have also managed to change the face of the NZ intarweb for
the worse through lack of clue when posting) - we dont want to loose the
one or two remaining.

Please keep off topic postings to the right area (and yes, orcon/telecom
connectivity issues are NOT DSL related)
--
Steve.

Post by Tony Paterson
For my money it's close enough.
I've been on this list a long time and its moved to more of a broadband focus, which I personally think is fine - after all people post about WiredCountry and Woosh.
Of course we have a moderator....
Just my two cents
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Sun 5/12/2004 9:26 p.m.
To: Steven Ellis
Subject: Re: Orcon ADSL issues today (Sunday 5 Dec)?
Its not about DSL at a technical level, as it appears to be Orcon specific
- and its certainly the kind of thing that should be addressed via their
tech support guys.
I can understand Steves frustration, as there seems to be a trend to post
on here about issues which really should go straight to helpdesks first.
I mean, I know that people with a slight technical bent dont tend to like
helpdesks - its that whole 'I know more than they do' mentality coupled
with the 'i dont want to sit on hold' mentality - however it does need to
be take into consideration that
1) they provide a service, this includes (or not) tech support.
2) This is a list for the discussion of ADSL Technical issues. This doesnt
extend to doing the ISP tech support role for them...
I personally think Steve is being slightly Nazi here, but untill such time
as this becomes a 'problem with UBS in general' it really is of limited
interest to a lot of the audience here, some of whom don't use UBS and
many of whom will not be Orcon customers.
IMHO.
Mark.

Post by Steven Ellis
Hmm
There is a TECHNICAL issue.. Hence reference technical email list..
I don't subscribe to chat as i'm only interested in technical
problem/issues etc.
Steve

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This message is part of the NZ ADSL mailing list.
see http://unixathome.org/adsl/ for archives, FAQ,
and various documents.
with "unsubscribe adsl" in the body of the message
--
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see http://unixathome.org/adsl/ for archives, FAQ,
and various documents.
with "unsubscribe adsl" in the body of the message

[Steven Ellis]

Post by Steve Phillips
If I wanted to be subscribed to
that I would
Please keep off topic postings to the right area (and yes,
orcon/telecom connectivity issues are NOT DSL related)

So issues with Orcon or Telecoms ADSL network are not ADSL related. Hmm
explain this one to me please as i'm obviously confused.

[Mark Foster]

Post by Steven Ellis

Post by Steve Phillips
If I wanted to be subscribed to
that I would
Please keep off topic postings to the right area (and yes,
orcon/telecom connectivity issues are NOT DSL related)

So issues with Orcon or Telecoms ADSL network are not ADSL related. Hmm
explain this one to me please as i'm obviously confused.

He means, as I said, that this list is not meant to substitute for your
ISPs helpdesk. 'DSL Related' in Steves context means that it speaks in
general terms of the technology, and not one particular ISPs aspect,
because as _already_ pointed out, SOME OF US ARE NOT ORCON CUSTOMERS.

Now can we leave it be?!?!?

[Steven Ellis]

Given the rather angry discussions that have recently taken place
perhaps it is time to define, or redefine the purpose of this group.
There definitely appears to be a considerable difference of opinion in
this area.

I have until now working under the assumption it was for discussing all
ADSL related technologies, changes in the market, and issues. Whilst
there are occasional references to other mediums (Cable, wireless etc)
there are generally off topic.

Whilst the list isn't here as a general help desk, it is the best place
to confirm if issues/problems are ISP, region, or platform specific. If
this isn't the case perhaps we need an adsl-issues list as this is a
long way from being a "chat" topic.

Just my thoughts on the matter.

Steve

[Bart Hanson]

Post by Steven Ellis
Whilst the list isn't here as a general help desk, it is the best
place to confirm if issues/problems are ISP, region, or platform
specific. If this isn't the case perhaps we need an adsl-issues list
as this is a long way from being a "chat" topic.

I have been on this list a couple of months now but am only just
beginning to see its true purpose, a technical forum to discuss issues
around ADSL. OK speed, latency, etc. can be discussed here, but not
quality of service or help desk wait times? both of which are always
ISP specific.

Is there another NZ list where people can discuss these things.
It could be called ***@lists.somewhere.nz:

If not, maybe someone could organise something, then those with a less
technical bent can stop "polluting" this list.
Of course there will always be crossover issues but people would then
be able to choose to subscribe to either or both.

Bart Hanson

***@orcon.net.nz

http://go.hotwired.com/news/politics/0,1283,65924,00.html/wn_ascii
http://s0.tx.co.nz/at/tep34i63461a4j30789s4c2031013t9f2n318264z

[Dave Mill]

What _I_ believe this list should be used for....

This list should be used to discuss general technical issues that
impact ADSL in New Zealand. This will include discussion related to
Routers and Modems and also general discussion regarding how DSL is
implemented in NZ. It should also include general outages that may
affect Jetstream, Jetstream Wholesale, or UBS as this is very useful
to the various ISP people that lurk on this list.

ISP specific issues seem to be the grey area here. Here is what I
believe should be acceptable and not...

Acceptable example post :

"Hi, I'm currently an Orcon UBS customer and I'm having issue A with
my connection. Do other non-Orcon people here have this issue or
should I just be phoning my ISP?"

Unacceptable example post :

"Hi, I'm an Orcon UBS customer and I'm having issue A with my
connection. Orcon don't answer my calls, or I can't be f*&ked phoning
them. What I really need is someone on this list to tell me what Orcon
or myself is doing wrong and hence magically fix this problem. I
really think that this is an issue that this list should solve rather
than the ISP that I pay my money to..."

And no, I'm not taking any specific stabs at Orcon here, it just
appears that the recent crap on this list appears to be generated by
Orcon UBS and non-UBS customer.

And again, no I'm not on this list to hear people whining about how
long it's taken to switch from 256kbit to 2mbit, I get enough of that
at work.

My $0.02.

Dave

Post by Bart Hanson

Post by Steven Ellis
Whilst the list isn't here as a general help desk, it is the best
place to confirm if issues/problems are ISP, region, or platform
specific. If this isn't the case perhaps we need an adsl-issues list
as this is a long way from being a "chat" topic.

I have been on this list a couple of months now but am only just
beginning to see its true purpose, a technical forum to discuss issues
around ADSL. OK speed, latency, etc. can be discussed here, but not
quality of service or help desk wait times? both of which are always
ISP specific.
Is there another NZ list where people can discuss these things.
If not, maybe someone could organise something, then those with a less
technical bent can stop "polluting" this list.
Of course there will always be crossover issues but people would then
be able to choose to subscribe to either or both.
Bart Hanson

[Jeremy Brooking]

So the solution is simple.

Post by Dave Mill
"Hi, I'm currently an Orcon UBS customer and I'm having issue A with
my connection. Do other non-Orcon people here have this issue or
should I just be phoning my ISP?"

Answer it.

Post by Dave Mill
"Hi, I'm an Orcon UBS customer and I'm having issue A with my
connection. Orcon don't answer my calls, or I can't be f*&ked phoning
them. What I really need is someone on this list to tell me what Orcon
or myself is doing wrong and hence magically fix this problem. I
really think that this is an issue that this list should solve rather
than the ISP that I pay my money to..."

Ignore it.



This is a mailing list, not rocket science.