Weird letter from Clear?

[Fran]

Has anyone had one of these letters?
It states that you have to transfer everything over to their ISP Paradise
Net or you will have problems.
One of my clients has received one of these letters and got me in because it
sounded too complicated for them to do themselves.
From talking to someone at Clear it appears that it's Xtra's fault and that
if you have Jetstream with any other ISP then Xtra will drop all services
to you at the end of August (now September).
My client was being told by Clear that they had to even transfer over their
domain name delegation to Paradise as well as changing their e-mail etc.
The lady at Clear also said that everyone would be getting a letter from
Xtra as well.

Is this kosher?

Sounds weird to me.

Fran
:):):)

[Joel Wiramu Pauling]

Post by Fran
Has anyone had one of these letters?
It states that you have to transfer everything over to their ISP Paradise
Net or you will have problems.
One of my clients has received one of these letters and got me in because it
sounded too complicated for them to do themselves.

Post by Fran
From talking to someone at Clear it appears that it's Xtra's fault and that

if you have Jetstream with any other ISP then Xtra will drop all services
to you at the end of August (now September).
My client was being told by Clear that they had to even transfer over their
domain name delegation to Paradise as well as changing their e-mail etc.
The lady at Clear also said that everyone would be getting a letter from
Xtra as well.
Is this kosher?
Sounds weird to me.
Fran
:):):)

Hi Fran,

The letter is correct, and NO it's not really Kosher. Basically many
people Myself included have been forced to either go with a downgraded
Bitstream service from their current ISP's or to retain Full rate
jetstream speeds and services Transfer to Xtra.

It's to do with the whole UBS ComCom Agreement, and Telecom playing
silly buggers with the ISP's I'm particularly effected as I am on a plan
that Xtra is no longer offering at all(2mbit down 192kps up). My choices
have been dicated as above, I either fork out megabucks for a Business
Plan, or have my Upstream cut and move to UBS. It's not really on, and I
taking it to Small claims court, my situation is a little bit different
to your clients in that I am guessing they have a Fullrate jetstream
plan which is still offered through Xtra only. I think Paradise/Telstra
are able to offer the Fullrate plans in the original Split plan like
option for a few more months longer than the other ISP's but eventually
they will drop it aswell.

I would suggest you take this up with the ISP in question, as well as
Telecom, and kindly request that any costs associated with transfer are
payed in full to your client or yourself as credit, if they don't front
up take them through Disputes tribunal.


Kind regards

Joel W

[Fran]

They pay Clear for fullspeed jetstream 600mb.
They are being told they have to go to Paradise (Why not Clear.net?, that's
who they've got the contract with) and cancel everything they've got with
Xtra - which has nothing to do with ADSL.

But transferring over the domain name delegation and having to cancel their
Xtra e-mail (paid for separately) and I think transfer their web hosting as
well?

That's the bit that's got me suspicious.
Not to mention pissed off.

I could understand it if they were being told that the plan they are on is
no longer supported and they will have to change to another one, but all
this?

Fran
:):):)

[paul warner]

Post by Fran
They pay Clear for fullspeed jetstream 600mb.
They are being told they have to go to Paradise (Why not Clear.net?, that's
who they've got the contract with) and cancel everything they've got with
Xtra - which has nothing to do with ADSL.
But transferring over the domain name delegation and having to cancel their
Xtra e-mail (paid for separately) and I think transfer their web hosting as
well?
That's the bit that's got me suspicious.
Not to mention pissed off.
I could understand it if they were being told that the plan they are on is
no longer supported and they will have to change to another one, but all
this?
Fran
:):):)

And how much is all this going to cost your client??


Regards,

Paul Warner

***@bigfoot.com

DVD spelt backwards is DVD

[Fran]

Post by paul warner
And how much is all this going to cost your client??

Well Clear said they would give a $60 refund.

But I don't know about the 2000 business cards that would need reprinting,
the yellow pages advert...

They would tell Clear to stick it but are tied up in a 2 year contract that
would cost $300 to break.

Fran
:):):)

[Scott Pettit]

Why does moving from one connection to another require all the business
cards and what not to be changed?

Post by Fran

Post by paul warner
And how much is all this going to cost your client??

Well Clear said they would give a $60 refund.
But I don't know about the 2000 business cards that would need reprinting,
the yellow pages advert...
They would tell Clear to stick it but are tied up in a 2 year contract that
would cost $300 to break.
Fran
:):):)

[Fran]

Post by Scott Pettit
Why does moving from one connection to another require all the business
cards and what not to be changed?

Because the person at Clear said they would have to cancel _all_ the stuff
they have with Xtra inc the e-mail address and set up a new account with
new address at Paradise.

That was one of the things that pegged my bullshit meter.

Fran
:):):)

[Reuben Farrelly]

Hi,

Post by Fran

Post by paul warner
And how much is all this going to cost your client??

Well Clear said they would give a $60 refund.
But I don't know about the 2000 business cards that would need reprinting,
the yellow pages advert...

Why? Were they (ill)advised to use @isp.co.nz addresses for their business
even though they had their own domain name? [This is something I see lots of
in NZ for some reason, it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever that a customer
is sold a domain name for a website, and then uses their ISP email address for
all their email, yet it seems to be the prevalent email thing over here...]

Post by Fran
They would tell Clear to stick it but are tied up in a 2 year contract that
would cost $300 to break.

That would hurt :( Ironically enough it sounds like it would be easiest for
them to move the lot properly to xtra, despite it being Telecom that caused
the problem in the first place..

Can they just not keep the @xtra email addresses under a separate paid up
account, or are people at xtra being unco-operative about that?

reuben

[Joel Wiramu Pauling]

Post by Reuben Farrelly
account, or are people at xtra being unco-operative about that?
reuben

It is xtra's policy not to do forwarding.... We used to have customers
ask this all the time when at paradise. Apparently whatever system xtra
use, "it is unable to add forwarding" This is the stock answer you will
get if you ask at the helpdesk

[Reuben Farrelly]

So avoid their helpdesk.

This page: http://www.xtra.co.nz/help/0,,9084,00.html#5

gives instructions on how to set up forwarding using 'xtramail'.

I don't have an xtra account to test though (long since gone from xtra..), I'm
only going by what is on their webpage which suggests it is now possible.

Or there's their secure xtra thing for $2.50/month. While I think the whole
'secure' thing is largely unnecessary, you'd weigh the costs of it for 12
months or so up against the cost of moving and redoing business cards until
next time etc etc.

Whatever the way, it is a hassle compared to keeping the status quo.

But the original question remains, why if they have their own domain, were
they using $isp.co.nz email addresses in the first place?

reuben

Post by Joel Wiramu Pauling

Post by Reuben Farrelly
account, or are people at xtra being unco-operative about that?
reuben

It is xtra's policy not to do forwarding.... We used to have customers
ask this all the time when at paradise. Apparently whatever system xtra
use, "it is unable to add forwarding" This is the stock answer you will
get if you ask at the helpdesk

[Mark Foster]

Thank goodness, the voice of reason.
Xtra have had a mail forwarding system for a long time. (How long ago did
they launch XtraMail? Nearly that long).
The issue is that their support staff are told not to actively advertise
the fact that the forwarding exists. Likewise the helpdesk staff do not
actually have the access to set up mail forwarding for a client. (They
have the same UI as a customer does... minus the right password, usually).

There is a team within Xtra's support structure who would give you the
right answers, and can do forwarding configs. Thats worst-case and its
not their tier 1 support team.

Oh, and the reason people don't ditch their original @isp.co.nz mail
account? "Because everyone knows this one".

The concept of mail migration (to another domain) and actually retiring an
old email address is scary to the non IT literate, particularly those in
business - becuase they are at risk of losing that potential sale /
customer contact.

The fact that if someone really wants to get hold of you 5 years down the
track they can always try the phone book often escapes people.

[But put yourself in the shoes of someone who's in their late 40's,
running their own business which theyve been in for say 15 years,
developed an online presence some 5 years ago because 'everyones doing it'
(and to not do so would be to give their competitors the advantage, etc),
but really doesn't use it for a lot more than email and the odd web page.
This, I think, describes a hell of a lot of the SOHO Businesses out there.
Us geek type folk often struggle to see how difficult these people can
find the Internet (and how hard it can be to find a consultant willing to
help them without ripping them off... or how hard it is to make the leap
of faith even when you do find that person)]

It is a fair point. I suppose for that reason, its
worthwhile budgeting to hold onto a $2.50-/month mail account and putting
a forwarding rule on it.

Anycase. I do agree that businesses should move their mail onto their own
domain once they have one. And that this can take a matter of years to
do, if you're wanting to be careful. A company that has elected not to do
this, well, they have noone to blame but themselves... as above, they have
the option fo a staged migration over time.

Heck, they still have that option.
Theres no reason worth a damn that I can think of that would stop Xtra
from charging Xtra services onto a nominated Telecom account, regardless
of what other Internet services are held. (Doing so would be questionably
legal in an anticompetitive sense any case).

Which brings me back to my first question; Did TCL get approached for
clarification?

Mark.

Post by Reuben Farrelly
So avoid their helpdesk.
This page: http://www.xtra.co.nz/help/0,,9084,00.html#5
gives instructions on how to set up forwarding using 'xtramail'.
I don't have an xtra account to test though (long since gone from xtra..),
I'm only going by what is on their webpage which suggests it is now possible.
Or there's their secure xtra thing for $2.50/month. While I think the whole
'secure' thing is largely unnecessary, you'd weigh the costs of it for 12
months or so up against the cost of moving and redoing business cards until
next time etc etc.
Whatever the way, it is a hassle compared to keeping the status quo.
But the original question remains, why if they have their own domain, were
they using $isp.co.nz email addresses in the first place?
reuben

Post by Joel Wiramu Pauling

Post by Reuben Farrelly
account, or are people at xtra being unco-operative about that?
reuben

It is xtra's policy not to do forwarding.... We used to have customers
ask this all the time when at paradise. Apparently whatever system xtra
use, "it is unable to add forwarding" This is the stock answer you will
get if you ask at the helpdesk

--
This message is part of the NZ ADSL mailing list. see
http://unixathome.org/adsl/ for archives, FAQ, and various documents. To
adsl" in the body of the message

[Fran]

Post by Mark Foster
Thank goodness, the voice of reason.
Xtra have had a mail forwarding system for a long time. (How long ago did
they launch XtraMail? Nearly that long).

Been using their forwarding myself for a couple of years now.

Post by Mark Foster
account? "Because everyone knows this one".

Yep, it's in the yellow pages, on business cards, all the adverts.

Post by Mark Foster
It is a fair point. I suppose for that reason, its
worthwhile budgeting to hold onto a $2.50-/month mail account and putting
a forwarding rule on it.

They do have one of these and Clear was telling me they would have to cancel
it along with transferring the domain delegation (asked for the UDAI).

Post by Mark Foster
Theres no reason worth a damn that I can think of that would stop Xtra
from charging Xtra services onto a nominated Telecom account, regardless
of what other Internet services are held. (Doing so would be
questionably legal in an anticompetitive sense any case).

That's what I thought too which made what I was being told very weird.

Post by Mark Foster
Which brings me back to my first question; Did TCL get approached for
clarification?

They were approached yes.
The first thing I did was call them.
Clarification? In a word - No.

Fran
:):):)

[Mark Foster]

Post by Fran

Post by Mark Foster
account? "Because everyone knows this one".

Yep, it's in the yellow pages, on business cards, all the adverts.

And as stated earlier, if theyve had the domain for more than a coupla
years, this is a problem of their own making. Their ads get renewed
yearly at the worst. Business cards are not that expensive either...

The problem with keeping your ISP driven domain is obvious - you become
tied to the success / reliability of a third party, with no flexibility.
A domain gives you control - at least, the control to move on if required.

Post by Fran

Post by Mark Foster
It is a fair point. I suppose for that reason, its
worthwhile budgeting to hold onto a $2.50-/month mail account and putting
a forwarding rule on it.

They do have one of these and Clear was telling me they would have to cancel
it along with transferring the domain delegation (asked for the UDAI).

Thats impressive. Theoretically theres nothin stopping Clear from having
all sorts of special requirements on a mail account they host. But theres
no way in hell they can affect your services with _another_ provider.

If holding services with another provider prevents you from holding
services with Clear, well, that becomes Clears loss doesnt it??

Post by Fran

Post by Mark Foster
Theres no reason worth a damn that I can think of that would stop Xtra
from charging Xtra services onto a nominated Telecom account, regardless
of what other Internet services are held. (Doing so would be
questionably legal in an anticompetitive sense any case).

That's what I thought too which made what I was being told very weird.

Post by Mark Foster
Which brings me back to my first question; Did TCL get approached for
clarification?

They were approached yes.
The first thing I did was call them.
Clarification? In a word - No.

Go back to them. Try again. Get it spelt out.
If they can't help you - ask for a Manager.
Keep doin this untill you run out of managers.
If that fails - go to the press...
I'd dearly love to read a copy of this letter, if theres any way you can
get it to me (scanned/faxed), maybe a second opinion would be useful?

Contact me off list if I can assist.

Mark.

[Jason Chuang]

Hmm, you are correct about Xtra's policy - Xtra will not set up forwarding
for you.
HOWEVER, Xtra's mail system does allow you to set up forwarding for
yourself.

Go and log on to XtraMail http://www.xtramail.co.nz and you will see an
option on
the left under Email Services called Vacation messages. You can set up
forwarding
here yourself. You can also send a reply advising of your new email address
(in the
vacation messages box).

All you need to do is maintain your Xtra account - Cheapest way to do this
is to
Change to the Xtra Prepay 2 hour plan for $5 per month. This will be fine as
long
as you do not want to connect using your Xtra username and password (why
would you need to anyway if you have changed ISP's and set up forwarding of
your
Xtra email).

Note: from another ISP you will only be able to access your XtraMail
(webmail) service
POP and SMTP are not available if you do not dial up to Xtra directly (for
security
reasons). But again if forwarding is set up correctly (eg. Do not save a
copy to your
Xtra mailbox) this is not an issue.

There is nothing wrong with Xtra or it's services (admittedly I have been a
customer for
over 8 years). However I have had to work around these issues for other
people and
the are plenty of options - you just need to know how to find and work them

Cheers

Jason


----- Original Message -----
From: "Joel Wiramu Pauling" <***@aenertia.net>
To: "Reuben Farrelly" <reuben-***@reub.net>
Cc: "Fran" <***@mobilecomputing.co.nz>; <***@lists.unixathome.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2005 8:50 PM
Subject: Re: Weird letter from Clear?

Post by Joel Wiramu Pauling

Post by Reuben Farrelly
account, or are people at xtra being unco-operative about that?
reuben

It is xtra's policy not to do forwarding.... We used to have customers
ask this all the time when at paradise. Apparently whatever system xtra
use, "it is unable to add forwarding" This is the stock answer you will
get if you ask at the helpdesk
--
This message is part of the NZ ADSL mailing list.
see http://unixathome.org/adsl/ for archives, FAQ,
and various documents.
with "unsubscribe adsl" in the body of the message

[Mark Foster]

All you need to do is maintain your Xtra account - Cheapest way to do this is
to
Change to the Xtra Prepay 2 hour plan for $5 per month. This will be fine as
long
as you do not want to connect using your Xtra username and password (why
would you need to anyway if you have changed ISP's and set up forwarding of
your
Xtra email).

Not quite. A hosted mailbox costs $2.50/month and actually allows dialup
at $2.50/hr also.

I think however that Frans customer actually needs to look at the inverse-
moving elsewhere and 'grandfathering' their clear.net.nz email address in
this manner.

Mark.

[Dave Williams]

The minimum account possible is $5 per month. You can get a dial up and
e-mail for $2.50 if you have a Jetstream account or more than 1 dial up.
Check the plans on the web site. http://xtra.co.nz/products/

For an extra $2.50 a month you can get secure e-mail which can be accessed
from any ISP in the world. http://xtra.co.nz/products/0,,11954,00.html

Dave

All you need to do is maintain your Xtra account - Cheapest way to do this is
to
Change to the Xtra Prepay 2 hour plan for $5 per month. This will be fine as
long
as you do not want to connect using your Xtra username and password (why
would you need to anyway if you have changed ISP's and set up forwarding of
your
Xtra email).

Not quite. A hosted mailbox costs $2.50/month and actually allows dialup
at $2.50/hr also.

I think however that Frans customer actually needs to look at the inverse-
moving elsewhere and 'grandfathering' their clear.net.nz email address in
this manner.

Mark.
--
This message is part of the NZ ADSL mailing list.
see http://unixathome.org/adsl/ for archives, FAQ,
and various documents.
To unsubscribe: send mail to ***@lists.unixathome.org
with "unsubscribe adsl" in the body of the message

[Joel Wiramu Pauling]

Appologies, the user setup up forwarding did not exist in 2000.

Post by Jason Chuang
Hmm, you are correct about Xtra's policy - Xtra will not set up forwarding
for you.
HOWEVER, Xtra's mail system does allow you to set up forwarding for
yourself.
Go and log on to XtraMail http://www.xtramail.co.nz and you will see an
option on
the left under Email Services called Vacation messages. You can set up
forwarding
here yourself. You can also send a reply advising of your new email address
(in the
vacation messages box).
All you need to do is maintain your Xtra account - Cheapest way to do this
is to
Change to the Xtra Prepay 2 hour plan for $5 per month. This will be fine as
long
as you do not want to connect using your Xtra username and password (why
would you need to anyway if you have changed ISP's and set up forwarding of
your
Xtra email).
Note: from another ISP you will only be able to access your XtraMail
(webmail) service
POP and SMTP are not available if you do not dial up to Xtra directly (for
security
reasons). But again if forwarding is set up correctly (eg. Do not save a
copy to your
Xtra mailbox) this is not an issue.
There is nothing wrong with Xtra or it's services (admittedly I have been a
customer for
over 8 years). However I have had to work around these issues for other
people and
the are plenty of options - you just need to know how to find and work them
Cheers
Jason
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2005 8:50 PM
Subject: Re: Weird letter from Clear?

Post by Joel Wiramu Pauling

Post by Reuben Farrelly
account, or are people at xtra being unco-operative about that?
reuben

It is xtra's policy not to do forwarding.... We used to have customers
ask this all the time when at paradise. Apparently whatever system xtra
use, "it is unable to add forwarding" This is the stock answer you will
get if you ask at the helpdesk
--
This message is part of the NZ ADSL mailing list.
see http://unixathome.org/adsl/ for archives, FAQ,
and various documents.
with "unsubscribe adsl" in the body of the message

[Mark Foster]

Post by Fran
They pay Clear for fullspeed jetstream 600mb.
They are being told they have to go to Paradise (Why not Clear.net?, that's
who they've got the contract with) and cancel everything they've got with
Xtra - which has nothing to do with ADSL.
But transferring over the domain name delegation and having to cancel their
Xtra e-mail (paid for separately) and I think transfer their web hosting as
well?
That's the bit that's got me suspicious.
Not to mention pissed off.
I could understand it if they were being told that the plan they are on is
no longer supported and they will have to change to another one, but all
this?

Sounds to me like a poorly worded letter from TCL.
Has anyone actually tried asking TCL what the story is?

The usual first-contact-should-be-your-helpdesk line just about fits in
here.

(And hey, if your provider arent providing adequate service - switch...)

[Fran]

Post by Mark Foster
Sounds to me like a poorly worded letter from TCL.
Has anyone actually tried asking TCL what the story is?

I _was_ talking to someone at Clear and was left feeling... unclean...

Fran
:):):)

[Craig Hoskin]

Yea ... have a customer who has exactly the same letter. They have ADSL
with World-Net, Domain hosting with me and Clear have said that to use
their ADSL plans their domain has to be delegated to them ... which is
absolute c^&p ... I mean they were probably just fishing... as they
Clear prob. just guessed they had a domain involved.

| -----Original Message-----
| From: Fran [mailto:***@mobilecomputing.co.nz]
| Sent: Tuesday, 6 September 2005 5:43 p.m.
| To: ADSL List
| Subject: Weird letter from Clear?
|
| Has anyone had one of these letters?
| It states that you have to transfer everything over to their
| ISP Paradise Net or you will have problems.
| One of my clients has received one of these letters and got
| me in because it sounded too complicated for them to do themselves.
| From talking to someone at Clear it appears that it's Xtra's
| fault and that if you have Jetstream with any other ISP then
| Xtra will drop all services to you at the end of August (now
| September).
| My client was being told by Clear that they had to even
| transfer over their domain name delegation to Paradise as
| well as changing their e-mail etc.
| The lady at Clear also said that everyone would be getting a
| letter from Xtra as well.
|
| Is this kosher?
|
| Sounds weird to me.
|
| Fran
| :):):)
|
| --
| This message is part of the NZ ADSL mailing list.
| see http://unixathome.org/adsl/ for archives, FAQ, and
| various documents.
| To unsubscribe: send mail to ***@lists.unixathome.org
| with "unsubscribe adsl" in the body of the message
|
|

[Craig Whitmore]

Post by Craig Hoskin
Yea ... have a customer who has exactly the same letter. They have ADSL
with World-Net, Domain hosting with me and Clear have said that to use
their ADSL plans their domain has to be delegated to them ... which is
absolute c^&p ... I mean they were probably just fishing... as they
Clear prob. just guessed they had a domain involved.

If they are saying this, then this is Clearly false advertising. (Or I may
be wrong)
Maybe they are only thinking about Xtra who don't allow people who are not
on their network to pick up email from their POP3 Servers.

Can someone post the contents of this letter?

Thanks
Craig
spam.co.nz

[Brendon Parkinson]

Regarding moving mail services to Clear and being told the domain has to
go to Clear as well:

Some of our customers have run into this same situation with Xtra.
Essentially, if you have email services set up with Xtra, using a domain
in the email, you have to move the domain to Xtra as well.
Why? Apparently Xtra do not allow sending through their SMTP server for
domains that essentially aren't on a "register of Xtra hosted domains".

It's very likely that Clear have adopted a similarly painful attitude?

If they have, I'd be interested to see the results. In every example of
the above with Xtra, the affected customer has decided to move *all*
their services away from Xtra.

I wonder if Clear customers are doing the same? (hint hint)


Regards,
Brendon


-----Original Message-----
From: owner-***@unixathome.org [mailto:owner-***@unixathome.org] On
Behalf Of Fran
Sent: Tuesday, 6 September 2005 9:52 p.m.
To: ***@lists.unixathome.org
Subject: Re: Weird letter from Clear?

Clear was telling me they would have to cancel
it along with transferring the domain delegation (asked for the UDAI).

[Reuben Farrelly]

Post by Brendon Parkinson
Regarding moving mail services to Clear and being told the domain has to
Some of our customers have run into this same situation with Xtra.
Essentially, if you have email services set up with Xtra, using a domain
in the email, you have to move the domain to Xtra as well.
Why? Apparently Xtra do not allow sending through their SMTP server for
domains that essentially aren't on a "register of Xtra hosted domains".
It's very likely that Clear have adopted a similarly painful attitude?
If they have, I'd be interested to see the results. In every example of
the above with Xtra, the affected customer has decided to move *all*
their services away from Xtra.
I wonder if Clear customers are doing the same? (hint hint)

My experience is that this seems to not be the case. A relative of mine is
connected via Xtra Broadband and to this day uses Xtra's mail server
smtp.xtra.co.nz to send out mail from _multiple_ domains, none of which either
mail or the domain is hosted with Xtra itself, infact they aren't even .nz
domains...

Of course mail coming in from non Xtra IP addresses to Xtra's mail server is a
different matter and the list you suggested above would be likely to do with
that, but I imagine you know that already :)

reuben

[Pete]

Post by Reuben Farrelly
My experience is that this seems to not be the case. A relative of
mine is connected via Xtra Broadband and to this day uses Xtra's
mail server smtp.xtra.co.nz to send out mail from _multiple_
domains, none of which either mail or the domain is hosted with
Xtra itself, infact they aren't even .nz domains...

Doh - that'll teach me for replying to one post before reading the
next! ;)

[Craig Hoskin]

Hi all

Just talked to the customer so here is the full situation

* They have ADSL currently with World-Net
* They have Line rentals and calls with Telstra Clear (this is in
Gisborne)
* They have domain delegation and hosting with me.

According to what Telstra Clear have told them on the phone they need to
shift "ALL" internet services to Telstra Clear, incl. Domain hosting,
delegation, Email boxes etc etc etc.

WorldNet, at the same time, are requesting they shift to their MegaPass
plans.

I have a copy of the letter which I'll chuck online soon at
Loading Image...
From what I read of the letter, it's a lot less demanding than what they
are getting via the phone.

So question.

If a company has the calls through Telstra Clear (as well as line
rental) is it possilbe (technically) to have their ADSL service through
"any" ISP, e.g. World-Net or do they have to use Telstra Clear?

Cheers

Craig

|
| > Yea ... have a customer who has exactly the same letter. They have
| > ADSL with World-Net, Domain hosting with me and Clear have
| said that
| > to use their ADSL plans their domain has to be delegated to
| them ...
| > which is absolute c^&p ... I mean they were probably just
| fishing...
| > as they Clear prob. just guessed they had a domain involved.
| >
|
| If they are saying this, then this is Clearly false
| advertising. (Or I may be wrong) Maybe they are only thinking
| about Xtra who don't allow people who are not on their
| network to pick up email from their POP3 Servers.
|
| Can someone post the contents of this letter?
|
| Thanks
| Craig
| spam.co.nz
|
|
|

[geoff]

It has to be DSL through Clear, if Clear is their "telco" (even if the line is
telecom essentially).

I had the same problem with my fathers line a couple of weeks ago. Both Xtra
AND Clear told him he *HAD* to move his email and hosting to them. Which of
course is impossible, because he uses my domain, and I control it :P I got
him to call them back and tell them just to provide ADSL and thats it. He
still had a big argument about it with them when he said he didnt want any
other services because he had a domain email address.
Pretty shoddy if you ask me.

Geoff

Post by Craig Hoskin
Hi all
Just talked to the customer so here is the full situation
* They have ADSL currently with World-Net
* They have Line rentals and calls with Telstra Clear (this is in
Gisborne)
* They have domain delegation and hosting with me.
According to what Telstra Clear have told them on the phone they need to
shift "ALL" internet services to Telstra Clear, incl. Domain hosting,
delegation, Email boxes etc etc etc.
WorldNet, at the same time, are requesting they shift to their MegaPass
plans.
I have a copy of the letter which I'll chuck online soon at
http://home.infobahn.co.nz/tclear/letter.jpg
From what I read of the letter, it's a lot less demanding than what they
are getting via the phone.
So question.
If a company has the calls through Telstra Clear (as well as line
rental) is it possilbe (technically) to have their ADSL service through
"any" ISP, e.g. World-Net or do they have to use Telstra Clear?
Cheers
Craig
| > Yea ... have a customer who has exactly the same letter. They have
| > ADSL with World-Net, Domain hosting with me and Clear have
|
| said that
|
| > to use their ADSL plans their domain has to be delegated to
|
| them ...
|
| > which is absolute c^&p ... I mean they were probably just
|
| fishing...
|
| > as they Clear prob. just guessed they had a domain involved.
|
| If they are saying this, then this is Clearly false
| advertising. (Or I may be wrong) Maybe they are only thinking
| about Xtra who don't allow people who are not on their
| network to pick up email from their POP3 Servers.
|
| Can someone post the contents of this letter?
|
| Thanks
| Craig
| spam.co.nz

[Nick Rout]

Dear list,

Can I just clarify about this letter (which i do not seem to have
received).

*My ISP is paradise
*My service is Jetstream, of the original variety, carried (as I
understand it) by Telecom
*I have nothing to do with xtra and never have.
*My voice and fax phone lines are provided by Telecom, who bill me for
ADSL (but not the ISP service which is provided by Paradise)

Will anything change for me? So I have to do anything? My reading of the letter posted by Craig Hoskin seems to relate only to people who have
their phone service provided by Telstra Clear?

Worried of ChCh.


On Wed, 7 Sep 2005 13:19:04 +1200

Post by Craig Hoskin
Hi all
Just talked to the customer so here is the full situation
* They have ADSL currently with World-Net
* They have Line rentals and calls with Telstra Clear (this is in
Gisborne)
* They have domain delegation and hosting with me.
According to what Telstra Clear have told them on the phone they need to
shift "ALL" internet services to Telstra Clear, incl. Domain hosting,
delegation, Email boxes etc etc etc.
WorldNet, at the same time, are requesting they shift to their MegaPass
plans.
I have a copy of the letter which I'll chuck online soon at
http://home.infobahn.co.nz/tclear/letter.jpg
From what I read of the letter, it's a lot less demanding than what they
are getting via the phone.
So question.
If a company has the calls through Telstra Clear (as well as line
rental) is it possilbe (technically) to have their ADSL service through
"any" ISP, e.g. World-Net or do they have to use Telstra Clear?
Cheers
Craig
|
| > Yea ... have a customer who has exactly the same letter. They have
| > ADSL with World-Net, Domain hosting with me and Clear have
| said that
| > to use their ADSL plans their domain has to be delegated to
| them ...
| > which is absolute c^&p ... I mean they were probably just
| fishing...
| > as they Clear prob. just guessed they had a domain involved.
| >
|
| If they are saying this, then this is Clearly false
| advertising. (Or I may be wrong) Maybe they are only thinking
| about Xtra who don't allow people who are not on their
| network to pick up email from their POP3 Servers.
|
| Can someone post the contents of this letter?
|
| Thanks
| Craig
| spam.co.nz
|
|
|
--
This message is part of the NZ ADSL mailing list.
see http://unixathome.org/adsl/ for archives, FAQ,
and various documents.
with "unsubscribe adsl" in the body of the message

[Brian Gibbons]

Post by Nick Rout
Can I just clarify about this letter (which i do not seem to have
received).

Prior postings are about a letter from TelstraClear to users that are being
billed by TelstraClear for Telecom ADSL.
You will be receiving a letter from Telecom as they bill you for ADSL.

Post by Nick Rout
*My ISP is paradise
*My service is Jetstream, of the original variety, carried (as I
understand it) by Telecom
*I have nothing to do with xtra and never have.
*My voice and fax phone lines are provided by Telecom, who bill me for
ADSL (but not the ISP service which is provided by Paradise)
Will anything change for me? So I have to do anything?

Yes and Yes.

You are the typical Jetstream Partnering Program (JSPP) User.

JSPP has been discontinued, you need to choose a new service, contact your
ISP.

Your (current Telecom ADSL) choices are WSA Jetstream which is (more or
less) a change of billing model. (move the $61.88+GST Jetstream 600 amount
from your Telecom bill to your ISP bill). Not all ISPs will support this
model, mainly due to credit risk and lack of margin.

Full rate WSA Jetstream will probably be withdrawn in the near future (i.e.
everyone will be rate limited to 128k upload speed). This is (apparently)
due to technical limitations (i.e. cable cross talk at the exchange end).

Your other choice is UBS i.e. 256k/128k, 1mb/128k, 2mb/128k.

Cheers

BG

[Fran]

Post by Craig Hoskin
I have a copy of the letter which I'll chuck online soon at
http://home.infobahn.co.nz/tclear/letter.jpg
From what I read of the letter, it's a lot less demanding than what they
are getting via the phone.

Exactly.
As far as I can tell, all you need do is change your ADSL plan to one of the
new ones.
I notice on the bottom of the letter it's "from the paradise.net team".
So to change the plan with Clear you have to go to a new one with Paradise?
Also the lady at Clear said we would be saving money but all the plans at
Paradise are more expensive...

They seem to just talk it up on the phone to mean you have to transfer
everything.

Fran
:):):)

[Craig Hoskin]

| -----Original Message-----
| From: Brian Gibbons [mailto:***@outersite.co.nz]
| Sent: Wednesday, 7 September 2005 3:59 p.m.
| To: Nick Rout; ***@lists.unixathome.org
| Subject: Re: Weird letter from Clear?
|
| >From: "Nick Rout" <***@rout.co.nz>
| > Can I just clarify about this letter (which i do not seem to have
| >received).
|
| Prior postings are about a letter from TelstraClear to users
| that are being billed by TelstraClear for Telecom ADSL.
| You will be receiving a letter from Telecom as they bill you for ADSL.

No ... that's just it ... it isn't.
My Customer has ADSL with WorldNet, but Calls with Telstra Clear.

I would have agreed with you based on the wording in the letter, but in
some ways it contradicts itself (I think) in that it opens with "As a
customer on Telstra Clear for HighSpeed Internet" ... and then says
"Currently, you do not use paradise.net (TelstraClear's ISP) to access
your HighSpeed Internet Service."

Im not full up on TelstraClears internet offerings, but I would have
thought the only "Highspeed Internet" they offer is through paradise.net
... ?

|
| > *My ISP is paradise
| > *My service is Jetstream, of the original variety, carried (as I
| > understand it) by Telecom *I have nothing to do with xtra and never
| > have.
| > *My voice and fax phone lines are provided by Telecom, who
| bill me for
| > ADSL (but not the ISP service which is provided by Paradise)
|
| > Will anything change for me? So I have to do anything?
|
| Yes and Yes.
|
| You are the typical Jetstream Partnering Program (JSPP) User.
|
| JSPP has been discontinued, you need to choose a new service,
| contact your ISP.
|
| Your (current Telecom ADSL) choices are WSA Jetstream which
| is (more or
| less) a change of billing model. (move the $61.88+GST
| Jetstream 600 amount from your Telecom bill to your ISP
| bill). Not all ISPs will support this model, mainly due to
| credit risk and lack of margin.
|
| Full rate WSA Jetstream will probably be withdrawn in the
| near future (i.e.
| everyone will be rate limited to 128k upload speed). This is
| (apparently) due to technical limitations (i.e. cable cross
| talk at the exchange end).
|
| Your other choice is UBS i.e. 256k/128k, 1mb/128k, 2mb/128k.
|
| Cheers
|
| BG
|
|
| --
| This message is part of the NZ ADSL mailing list.
| see http://unixathome.org/adsl/ for archives, FAQ, and
| various documents.
| To unsubscribe: send mail to ***@lists.unixathome.org
| with "unsubscribe adsl" in the body of the message
|
|